Greenock Family History, 1847-2000
by Nancy Quaid
The Greenock/Redpath/Ridpath Families in the United States
A Continuation of John Greenock’s story entitled:
Dedicated to my parents
Nancy J. Quaid
This collection of historical notes and stories about the Greenock family is a summary of information obtained over the past years of inquiry; much of it provided by family members to whom I am greatly indebted. I consider it a duty and privilege to write this biographical history on their behalf.
We have focused mainly on information about our direct lineage, however, we have also attempted to provide documentation on related families when it was made available. It is with a feeling of regret that there is some lack of information and/or personal knowledge. In some instances, we know more of how our ancestors died, rather than the way they lived. We have tried to piece some of the stories together and present a factual history in an interesting fashion. We believe that the inclusion of dates and places, although distracting at times, is necessary so that future genealogists will have advantages we did not have!
My Grandfather’s admonition to watch for the correct spelling of the Greenock name is appreciated. In our research, we have often come across Greenough, a family that enjoys much recorded history. Our research also re-introduced us to what John Greenock was able to uncover. We have not discovered (as yet) a family member that was rich, powerful or famous, however, we also have not discovered a scoundrel. What we did find was hard working, deeply committed, self-reliant, self-respecting, strong family members of good character, who all served their God and country with honor. Our family has embraced many different faiths, Methodist, Presbyterian, Jehovah’s Witness, Roman Catholic, Judiasm, Church of the Brethren, to name a few. I believe we have a Mormon in good standing in our family because several ordinances of the church have been done on behalf of our ancestors.
In 1933 John Greenock, my grandfather began his quest to trace the family names of Greenock/Redpath/Ridpath. His parents, Robert Greenock and Jane Redpath Greenock had met and married in Glasgow, Scotland and immigrated to the United States around 1881. Research into the Redpath/Ridpath family names was a result of his maternal lineage. Although Redpath is the family name, some use of the name Ridpath was a result of misspelling or common usage. At this time (2000), it appears there is only one person (our direct lineage) carrying on the name Greenock. That is Daniel J. Greenock, grandson of Joseph R. Greenock.
The carefully scripted, hand-written version of what John Greenock composed is attached in the Appendix [here], and we recommend your reading it. John Greenock spent a great deal of time at a writing table, using an orange Parker pen, compiling the data he was able to assemble. He wrote this story as he spoke, with a great deal of religious conviction, warmth, and intelligence. When you read this wonderful story, keep in mind that John’s formal education ended at the fifth grade level, but apparently his love of learning never ceased. There are six hand-written versions of this story, and not all of them are exactly the same. I suspect that Grandpa refined his story as he wrote the six different copies. In May of l946, this story was accepted by the Newberry Library in Chicago. It is my intent to file the attached as a continuation.
John Greenock mentioned in his story that a Greenock had not died on the field of battle. As you will see, our family members have served in all of the military actions since the Greenocks emigrated here, and although several were wounded, we still have not lost a family member to war.
John Greenock’s recollection of life in Scotland was very gentle. Glasgow’s population had grown three-fold between 1860 and 1900, and became known as ‘tenement city.’ The problems were enormous. Crime, misery, disease and filth were the norm. Crusades for sanitation did not occur until after 1900. After the potato famine in Ireland, thousands crowded into Scotland’s larger cities. Since the Irish immigrants were fleeing from starvation, they were happy to accept any wage and to put up with any living condition. Whole families lived in one room. My hope is that the Robert & Jane Greenock family were spared the reported misery of that time period. It is easier now for me to understand that they would leave their homeland. My impression of Scotland has always been of lush land, rolling hills of heather, a land rich in tradition and legend. In my recent research, I have discovered that wasn’t quite the way it was!
But what did they find when they got to Chicago? Perhaps things were better, and there was always hope, but the work situation for unskilled laborers was not wonderful. They made pennies a day! And worked long, long days in order to earn that. How did the depression of 1893 affect our great grandfather? Was he able to find work? Was he at all involved with the Columbian Exposition held in Jackson Park? We know that John and Flora Greenock attended that Exposition while they were courting. What did they observe? Probably an introduction to moving pictures, the Ferris Wheel, the Women’s Movement Pavillion, foods from many different nations, progress in transportation. It is said that Chicago got the name ‘windy city’ because of the super sales job done in order to get this World Expo in Chicago, rather than in New York or St. Louis.
From the book called Surnames of Scotland:
The 75-year privacy act has held us somewhat restricted insofar as records are concerned. I have been able to review several research resources. I think the one I most enjoyed was going through the census records for the years 1841, 1851, 1861 and 1871 for the City of Glasgow, counties of Lanark and Renfrew (City of Greenock). The census was done in each instance in one evening. The enumerator visited each family in his area, recorded the information given, and all of the information was then compiled in Edinburgh. Reading the occupations listed was fun; some I found particularly interesting was stone draper, mole catcher, mole catcher wife, mole catcher son, hawker, cordwainer (shoemaker), fund holder, city missionary, yarn winder (many, many worked in the textile industry), iron turner and finisher, fishmonger, chimney sweep, farmer of arable acres, farmer wife, and farmer daughter (and we’ve all heard about her) to name just a few. I reviewed Parish records from Glasgow and found them a good source of information as they listed where people lived and what their occupations were. The degree of accuracy particularly as respects the spelling of names was not always reliable, but these records were the best tracking available, particularly until such time as the census started to be taken (1841 was the first one done in Scotland). Christenings were listed, not necessarily during the month/year of birth. Christenings happened when clergy was available, which could mean that several family members could have been christened, and listed in Parish records during a given month and year, but actual birth dates occurred since the last clergy visit. We have heard that Scottish people didn’t name their babies until the time of the christening. That could have been a problem if the wee one had to wait a couple of months (or even years) for the clergy to come around!
U.S. Social Security death records have been of some help. Some that could have applied for Social Security after it was instituted in the 1930s apparently did not do so. Those that had a pension plan such as the railroads offer, or were self-employed, apparently didn’t apply for social security. The family members I did locate were Harry Greenock, Joseph P. Greenock and his wife Mary, May Greenock (wife of George F.) and Robert Greenock (husband of Florence Jones Greenock).
I also have spent time at the National Archives and Library of Congress in Washington, D.C. The genealogical societies in various states helped immensely. Cemetery caretakers proved to be a valuable resource. In one instance, I wrote to fifteen different cemeteries where I thought one of our family members could have been buried. I was fortunate to have gotten responses from most, but was indeed fortunate to have heard from the caretaker where our family member is buried.
We are now part of a new Millennium. The progress made in the 20th Century has been awesome. Our parents and grandparents witnessed vast changes in life in the United States. At that time, people fell in love, married and had children (pretty much in that order). Hardware was a place you went when tools were needed. Software was not even heard of until recently. There were World Wars, and several other ‘military actions.’ All added to change in the name of progress. When the Greenock clan immigrated to the United States, bread was less than a nickel a loaf; it is now more than a dollar a loaf, however, it is sliced (that’s progress). The progress in technology, that we take so for granted, our ancestors witnessed firsthand! Introduction of refrigerated railroad cars was a giant step forward, and as you will see, many of our families made their living with the railroad and meat packing industries.
How I would love to talk with Grandpa John Greenock now. I now understand what a great service he did for our family in recording our history, and I truly appreciate his effort. I have so many questions. Like, the stories he shared with us, were they passed on to him by his parents, or did his research reveal them? Was his Mother his source of family facts? Was his father his source? I am told his father worked hard at making a living and was often away from home. My Mom was only three years old when Robert Greenock died, but her father told her that Robert Greenock was a very gregarious, fun-loving person and didn’t take life very seriously. He also drank more than folks thought he should. Mom thought George Flaws Greenock was most like his Dad. Did our great grandpa find employment in Packingtown? It is my understanding the meat packing industry in the late 1890s and 1900s was at best a difficult place to work. Same with the grain industry - workers were made to work long hours under difficult circumstances, for little pay, if they could get themselves hired. For more insight into this situation, read Upton Sinclair’s, The Jungle. Not light reading!
Where did George Flaws Greenock get his middle name? I learned recently, after reading a letter written by Grandpa written in the early 1940s, that George Flaws was named for a family friend, a railroad man from Scotland. The immigrant family’s lives were very intertwined. It was common for friends and family to live together in an effort to help one another out. How did the Depression of the 30s affect our families’ lives?
We all should be interested in who our ancestors were. We carry on traits that are more than just hair and eye color. We need to know predisposition to physical and mental tendencies. We are all unique, but also very much a part of our heritage. We can be proud of our Scottish heritage. Andrew Carnegie was a Scottish immigrant, and he did all right for himself. When you read anything by Robert Louis Stevenson, or Sir Walter Scott, always remember, they also were Scottish! And Robert Burns’ poetry is truly beautiful to read. I said beautiful, not easy. The craftsmen Scotland produced are also a source of pride
A book by Robert Louis Stevenson called 'From Glasgow to Silverado' has a very descriptive narrative of his own ocean crossing in 1879 (the same year Robert Greenock immigrated). Very interesting reading. He mentioned that steerage prices on this steamship line were six guineas per person and that they had to bring their own utensils and bedding. I understand that all steamship lines were not created equal, but I also think they weren't all that different in pricing, etc. He also discussed the attitude of the emigrants he encountered - some hopeful, some going to the new land simply because the situation was so impossible in Scotland, some arrogant and some very lazy. His description of the voyage I believe to be very indicative of what our immigrant family encountered. In 1879 the port of Glasgow could not accommodate large vessels, thus they had to board a smaller ship to take them to Greenock to board their ship.
I am especially indebted to my parents, Helen and Marshall Jackson for their searching their memories and records to assist in this research, and their continued support of this endeavor. Indeed, it has been with the help of many that we have been able to re-construct our family history since the last writing in 1946 and we trust and hope that what we have put together is worthy of the effort.
For Auld Lang Syne ...
Next: Chapter 1: Robert and Jane Redpath Greenock
by Nancy Quaid
In loving memory of my mother, Helen Greenock Jackson.
The Greenock/Redpath/Ridpath Families in the United States
A Continuation of John Greenock’s story entitled:
The Greenock Family in the United States prior to 1779.
The Redpath-Ridpath Families.
Dedicated to my parents
Helen Jeanie (Greenock) Jackson
Marshall Benton Jackson
And to my maternal grandfather
John Greenock
born 28 May l870 in Glasgow, Scotland, died 19 July l947 in Des Plaines, Ill
Nancy J. Quaid
This collection of historical notes and stories about the Greenock family is a summary of information obtained over the past years of inquiry; much of it provided by family members to whom I am greatly indebted. I consider it a duty and privilege to write this biographical history on their behalf.
We have focused mainly on information about our direct lineage, however, we have also attempted to provide documentation on related families when it was made available. It is with a feeling of regret that there is some lack of information and/or personal knowledge. In some instances, we know more of how our ancestors died, rather than the way they lived. We have tried to piece some of the stories together and present a factual history in an interesting fashion. We believe that the inclusion of dates and places, although distracting at times, is necessary so that future genealogists will have advantages we did not have!
My Grandfather’s admonition to watch for the correct spelling of the Greenock name is appreciated. In our research, we have often come across Greenough, a family that enjoys much recorded history. Our research also re-introduced us to what John Greenock was able to uncover. We have not discovered (as yet) a family member that was rich, powerful or famous, however, we also have not discovered a scoundrel. What we did find was hard working, deeply committed, self-reliant, self-respecting, strong family members of good character, who all served their God and country with honor. Our family has embraced many different faiths, Methodist, Presbyterian, Jehovah’s Witness, Roman Catholic, Judiasm, Church of the Brethren, to name a few. I believe we have a Mormon in good standing in our family because several ordinances of the church have been done on behalf of our ancestors.
 |
| John Greenock |
The carefully scripted, hand-written version of what John Greenock composed is attached in the Appendix [here], and we recommend your reading it. John Greenock spent a great deal of time at a writing table, using an orange Parker pen, compiling the data he was able to assemble. He wrote this story as he spoke, with a great deal of religious conviction, warmth, and intelligence. When you read this wonderful story, keep in mind that John’s formal education ended at the fifth grade level, but apparently his love of learning never ceased. There are six hand-written versions of this story, and not all of them are exactly the same. I suspect that Grandpa refined his story as he wrote the six different copies. In May of l946, this story was accepted by the Newberry Library in Chicago. It is my intent to file the attached as a continuation.
John Greenock mentioned in his story that a Greenock had not died on the field of battle. As you will see, our family members have served in all of the military actions since the Greenocks emigrated here, and although several were wounded, we still have not lost a family member to war.
John Greenock’s recollection of life in Scotland was very gentle. Glasgow’s population had grown three-fold between 1860 and 1900, and became known as ‘tenement city.’ The problems were enormous. Crime, misery, disease and filth were the norm. Crusades for sanitation did not occur until after 1900. After the potato famine in Ireland, thousands crowded into Scotland’s larger cities. Since the Irish immigrants were fleeing from starvation, they were happy to accept any wage and to put up with any living condition. Whole families lived in one room. My hope is that the Robert & Jane Greenock family were spared the reported misery of that time period. It is easier now for me to understand that they would leave their homeland. My impression of Scotland has always been of lush land, rolling hills of heather, a land rich in tradition and legend. In my recent research, I have discovered that wasn’t quite the way it was!
But what did they find when they got to Chicago? Perhaps things were better, and there was always hope, but the work situation for unskilled laborers was not wonderful. They made pennies a day! And worked long, long days in order to earn that. How did the depression of 1893 affect our great grandfather? Was he able to find work? Was he at all involved with the Columbian Exposition held in Jackson Park? We know that John and Flora Greenock attended that Exposition while they were courting. What did they observe? Probably an introduction to moving pictures, the Ferris Wheel, the Women’s Movement Pavillion, foods from many different nations, progress in transportation. It is said that Chicago got the name ‘windy city’ because of the super sales job done in order to get this World Expo in Chicago, rather than in New York or St. Louis.
From the book called Surnames of Scotland:
GREENOCK, Grinock. From the town of Greenock in Renfrewshire. Huwe de Grenhok of the count of Lanark rendered homage in 1296. Sir John Grenok was chaplain and curate of Carriden in 1538 (Johnsoun), Robertus Greenock, faber ferrarius, in Bannockburne, 1699, and the Rev. James Grinock was minister of Gourock from 1780 to 1789.The origin of the name of the City of Greenock, Scotland is in doubt. It may come from the Gaelic meaning a sunny bay on the hill of the sun, but the natives of the town are rather skeptical of this explanation! It might have come from the story of an oak tree which grew so close to the riverbank that fishermen made fast their cables to its trunk. A seaport and burgh in west Scotland, in Renfrewshire on the Clyde River Estuary, 21 miles WNW of Glasgow. It is an important shipping and industrial center (and the birthplace of Captain Kidd!). We might be able to track our family to this city with a beautiful name, however, at this point I have not been able to do so. Grandpa Greenock stated the only time he had seen it was as they floated down the River Clyde on their way to the USA. One would think that with such strong names, Greenock and Redpath, research would be easy. Not quite so!
The 75-year privacy act has held us somewhat restricted insofar as records are concerned. I have been able to review several research resources. I think the one I most enjoyed was going through the census records for the years 1841, 1851, 1861 and 1871 for the City of Glasgow, counties of Lanark and Renfrew (City of Greenock). The census was done in each instance in one evening. The enumerator visited each family in his area, recorded the information given, and all of the information was then compiled in Edinburgh. Reading the occupations listed was fun; some I found particularly interesting was stone draper, mole catcher, mole catcher wife, mole catcher son, hawker, cordwainer (shoemaker), fund holder, city missionary, yarn winder (many, many worked in the textile industry), iron turner and finisher, fishmonger, chimney sweep, farmer of arable acres, farmer wife, and farmer daughter (and we’ve all heard about her) to name just a few. I reviewed Parish records from Glasgow and found them a good source of information as they listed where people lived and what their occupations were. The degree of accuracy particularly as respects the spelling of names was not always reliable, but these records were the best tracking available, particularly until such time as the census started to be taken (1841 was the first one done in Scotland). Christenings were listed, not necessarily during the month/year of birth. Christenings happened when clergy was available, which could mean that several family members could have been christened, and listed in Parish records during a given month and year, but actual birth dates occurred since the last clergy visit. We have heard that Scottish people didn’t name their babies until the time of the christening. That could have been a problem if the wee one had to wait a couple of months (or even years) for the clergy to come around!
U.S. Social Security death records have been of some help. Some that could have applied for Social Security after it was instituted in the 1930s apparently did not do so. Those that had a pension plan such as the railroads offer, or were self-employed, apparently didn’t apply for social security. The family members I did locate were Harry Greenock, Joseph P. Greenock and his wife Mary, May Greenock (wife of George F.) and Robert Greenock (husband of Florence Jones Greenock).
I also have spent time at the National Archives and Library of Congress in Washington, D.C. The genealogical societies in various states helped immensely. Cemetery caretakers proved to be a valuable resource. In one instance, I wrote to fifteen different cemeteries where I thought one of our family members could have been buried. I was fortunate to have gotten responses from most, but was indeed fortunate to have heard from the caretaker where our family member is buried.
We are now part of a new Millennium. The progress made in the 20th Century has been awesome. Our parents and grandparents witnessed vast changes in life in the United States. At that time, people fell in love, married and had children (pretty much in that order). Hardware was a place you went when tools were needed. Software was not even heard of until recently. There were World Wars, and several other ‘military actions.’ All added to change in the name of progress. When the Greenock clan immigrated to the United States, bread was less than a nickel a loaf; it is now more than a dollar a loaf, however, it is sliced (that’s progress). The progress in technology, that we take so for granted, our ancestors witnessed firsthand! Introduction of refrigerated railroad cars was a giant step forward, and as you will see, many of our families made their living with the railroad and meat packing industries.
How I would love to talk with Grandpa John Greenock now. I now understand what a great service he did for our family in recording our history, and I truly appreciate his effort. I have so many questions. Like, the stories he shared with us, were they passed on to him by his parents, or did his research reveal them? Was his Mother his source of family facts? Was his father his source? I am told his father worked hard at making a living and was often away from home. My Mom was only three years old when Robert Greenock died, but her father told her that Robert Greenock was a very gregarious, fun-loving person and didn’t take life very seriously. He also drank more than folks thought he should. Mom thought George Flaws Greenock was most like his Dad. Did our great grandpa find employment in Packingtown? It is my understanding the meat packing industry in the late 1890s and 1900s was at best a difficult place to work. Same with the grain industry - workers were made to work long hours under difficult circumstances, for little pay, if they could get themselves hired. For more insight into this situation, read Upton Sinclair’s, The Jungle. Not light reading!
Where did George Flaws Greenock get his middle name? I learned recently, after reading a letter written by Grandpa written in the early 1940s, that George Flaws was named for a family friend, a railroad man from Scotland. The immigrant family’s lives were very intertwined. It was common for friends and family to live together in an effort to help one another out. How did the Depression of the 30s affect our families’ lives?
We all should be interested in who our ancestors were. We carry on traits that are more than just hair and eye color. We need to know predisposition to physical and mental tendencies. We are all unique, but also very much a part of our heritage. We can be proud of our Scottish heritage. Andrew Carnegie was a Scottish immigrant, and he did all right for himself. When you read anything by Robert Louis Stevenson, or Sir Walter Scott, always remember, they also were Scottish! And Robert Burns’ poetry is truly beautiful to read. I said beautiful, not easy. The craftsmen Scotland produced are also a source of pride
A book by Robert Louis Stevenson called 'From Glasgow to Silverado' has a very descriptive narrative of his own ocean crossing in 1879 (the same year Robert Greenock immigrated). Very interesting reading. He mentioned that steerage prices on this steamship line were six guineas per person and that they had to bring their own utensils and bedding. I understand that all steamship lines were not created equal, but I also think they weren't all that different in pricing, etc. He also discussed the attitude of the emigrants he encountered - some hopeful, some going to the new land simply because the situation was so impossible in Scotland, some arrogant and some very lazy. His description of the voyage I believe to be very indicative of what our immigrant family encountered. In 1879 the port of Glasgow could not accommodate large vessels, thus they had to board a smaller ship to take them to Greenock to board their ship.
I am especially indebted to my parents, Helen and Marshall Jackson for their searching their memories and records to assist in this research, and their continued support of this endeavor. Indeed, it has been with the help of many that we have been able to re-construct our family history since the last writing in 1946 and we trust and hope that what we have put together is worthy of the effort.
For Auld Lang Syne ...
Next: Chapter 1: Robert and Jane Redpath Greenock
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